This actually could be generalized to have a bigger problem: We need standard API to do the following: Ask some params from synth. Set some params of synth. Use a synth on sample-by-sample or chunk-by-chunk basis. Many parameters of most synths can be controlled through MIDI, if that's what you're looking for. As for seamless interconnection, that's never really something that exists. ChucK even uses a sample buffer (of 256 samples by default), so any "mouse movements" that you're making are already getting delayed by that amount.

So, it looks like what you actually want is something like Pure Data (open-source) or Max/MSP (commercial product). PD has a standard object called [vst~] that you could load ZynAddSubFX into and get all you need out of it without ever touching a MIDI protocol. As it seems that chuck doesn't do what you want it to do, and probably won't in the foreseeable future, I'd suggest just downloading PD rather than begin to learn a programming language that doesn't natively support external synths. Most people, I think, use chuck because they want to build their own synths from the ground up. If you want some tips on particular sounds, maybe check out the electro-music forums for sample code. -Andrew

To explain my situation: 1. I am indeed willing to create my own instruments and would not start with language, which is not designed for that. 2. I would like to also use other instruments (like pianos - there is no point in designing my own classical piano until I'm very good in that) in orchestras. 3. I would like to already create nice-sounding songs. About 3. it's also that I would like, when I have visitors, to be able to start up something really fast - so that I could improvise and they could improvise. And, of course, using the same tool, which easily allows one to add some new synthesizer or new twist to existing one. To explain, what I miss and lack: * Drums. * Bass. * Flutes etc., which would sound naturally. And, another aspect (not related to this letter), which has to do with STK - when I use it as synth, I would like to do the following: * Have some objects, which disappear and disconnect themselves as soon as their sound is over. Currently, I have 4 seconds just-in-case (otherwise it will cut some sounds) and create some hundreds of them sometimes (to have a fast beat). Making them 0.5 secs will make it a lot faster - so that I can listen to it in realtime -, but it also makes some longer beats cut from an end. * Have such STK class/object, which allows me to play instruments in such way that when I play piano, the object is not silent when I try to play another tone without having previous one gone silent (because that's the reason, why I have to have so much of those sporked objects there). But, basically - I would like to create some songs from scratch without creating synthesizers for each instrument myself first. Even when you are creating synthesizer from scratch, it's nice to test it with other instruments in background - and especially, it's nice to create someting nice-sounding right at the beginning and in process, not after two months, when I have managed into creating my first realistic instrument :) And, btw., I'm also somewhat learning PD as I read a book, which uses it in examples. I'm not happy with graphical design and it also does not seem to be so flexible as ChucK - for example, time control is far from that of ChucK, also it's hard to keep track of everything you have done (text sources, anyway, are best for that). Tambet On 11 September 2010 12:20, Tambet wrote:

2010/9/11 Andrew C. Smith

...

As it seems that chuck doesn't do what you want it to do, and probably won't in the foreseeable future, I'd suggest just downloading PD rather than begin to learn a programming language that doesn't natively support external synths.

I already know most of the language - what I learn right now is the actual use of UGens and what I will do next is learning UAnae.

Most people, I think, use chuck because they want to build their own synths

...

from the ground up. If you want some tips on particular sounds, maybe check out the electro-music forums for sample code.

I do, but basically I think that typical ones should be reusably there.

Also, I would like to do some fast-start.

I am looking into compiling Faust into ChucK, which seems to be best to my processor usage. Anyway, it presumes learning faust :)

-Andrew

...

_______________________________________________ chuck-users mailing list chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu https://lists.cs.princeton.edu/mailman/listinfo/chuck-users

2010/9/11 Tambet

To explain my situation:

<snip>

To explain, what I miss and lack: * Drums.

<snip> I agree. We could really use a decent percussion-synth UGen or two. *Nothing makes synthesis as appealing to new students like percussion synthesis. *Some livecoding organisations and people frown on loading external material like samples *Everyone likes Roland X0X-style sounds, secretly or not. It's -in my experience- a rare computer-music researcher who won't admit to a fondness for solid house tracks after a beer or two (research yet unpublished, performed by the author in the hallways of STEIM and various other organisations. Waiting for grants for more beer to continue this research). Yours, Kas.

On 11 Sep 2010, at 01:13, Tambet wrote:

...

also... what do you mean by 'natural sounds' ?

Natural sound would be the one, which does not sound like if it was obviously generated by some digital device.

There has been discussed here on the list to write ones own UGen, and recompile ChucK. If ChucK could load dynamic libraries, then no recompilation of ChucK would be needed, but I do not think ChucK can do that.

On 11 September 2010 15:48, Hans Aberg wrote:

On 11 Sep 2010, at 01:13, Tambet wrote:

also... what do you mean by 'natural sounds' ?

...

...

Natural sound would be the one, which does not sound like if it was obviously generated by some digital device.

There has been discussed here on the list to write ones own UGen, and recompile ChucK.

If ChucK could load dynamic libraries, then no recompilation of ChucK would be needed, but I do not think ChucK can do that.

Yes, but I have yet to go several steps for that. My current tests of ChucK: - http://picosong.com/qbV/ - this is using STK and some UGens to get some ambient sound. It's mixed with Audacity. - http://picosong.com/qAa/ - this uses several oscillators and Math.sin(...) to create something like mix of cat marriage and air alarm. Despite of it's utter ugliness it's even somewhat addictive somehow :) But there should be some health-care warning on it. On 11 September 2010 16:10, Thomas Girod wrote:

Maybe I'm missing the point, but it sound like what you want to do is

composing music, rather than experimenting with sounds. If you want instruments that sounds realistic, maybe you should search for some good VSTi and soundfonts, and pilot all this from a sequencer.

that way, you could quickly sketch a drumbeat, a melody, and improvise

from there ... Yes, I actually am going to use ChucK to compose. I want to create songs. As I have done a lot of software development, I was looking for programming language, which is not too much one-purposed (like creating scores, synthesizing sound, programming this or that aspect of some readily-available synth or generating midi), but would do all those things in both realtime and preprocessed modes. ChucK clearly is that and other languages I looked into clearly are not. Csound was somewhat interesting, but too complex and not so coherent - it rather seems like a bunch of random functions to create things in C. Faust attracted me with mathematical purity. I like to have all programming power at my hands whenever I need it when I'm doing something with computer - like doing 3D with PovRAY and writing text with LaTeX. Thus, natural way to compose is ChucK. Anyway, I also want to create effects to existing voices and instruments, where ChucK is rather irreplaceable (one would need something very similar to replace it for good). 2010/9/11 Kassen

Hans;

...

If ChucK could load dynamic libraries, then no recompilation of ChucK would be needed, but I do not think ChucK can do that.

It's one of the oldest wishlist items though, and support for this in some form is planned.

Kas.

That's just what I was thinking today. 2010/9/11 Kassen

2010/9/11 Tambet

To explain my situation:

<snip>

To explain, what I miss and lack:

* Drums.

<snip>

I agree. We could really use a decent percussion-synth UGen or two.

*Nothing makes synthesis as appealing to new students like percussion synthesis.

*Some livecoding organisations and people frown on loading external material

like samples

*Everyone likes Roland X0X-style sounds, secretly or not. It's -in my

experience- a rare computer-music researcher who won't admit to a fondness for solid house tracks after a beer or two (research yet unpublished, performed by the author in the hallways of STEIM and various other organisations. Waiting for grants for more beer to continue this research).

Yours,

Kas. This is true. I would like those UGens. Rhythym