Hi Sheri. On windows, chuck gets installed into "c:\Program Files (x86)\ChucK". On linux, I do not know where to find it, but most likely /user/bin or /usr/local/bin, but not being much of a linux user, really not sure. I noticed in your previous message you said you were visually impaired. Are you using a screen reader? If so, Mini Audicle may not be accessible; it is not on windows at all.  If your using magnification, you've probably got a good chance of making use of it. I also happen to be blind and use a screen reader on windows. I've done chuck hacking with just the command line and a text editor; it works pretty well. However, if you want to pass parameters to your program you need to do everything either on the command line, or hard code parameters into your source. For experimentation it's fine, but for something which needs to be used by others, it may become quite hard to manage as things get complicated.  The mini audical apparently allows you to create UI widgets that can send parameters to a running chuck program, which means you can vary things on the fly, which you cannot do just running from the command line. All that said, it's a great language and you can learn a lot about signal processing playing with chuck. Complements to the chuck team for their continuous work on the language over the years. It's probably the most accessible audio processing language out there, mostly because it is just the language; it does not require a complex GUI environment in which to run. Hope this is helpful. -- Rich On 1/15/2018 2:39 PM, Sheri W-J wrote:

I promise to have real thinking questions later but for now: The program I installed (which seemed like my only choice) was miniaudicle. The online documentation is prompting me to run chuck  from the command line... I know about the terminal and I run perl from the command line so that would be OK ... except these two things do not match up, and I see nothing actually called chuck on my hard drive. What did I miss? Thanks so much, Sheri

On Jan 15, 2018, at 6:47 AM, Casper Schipper mailto:casper.schipper@gmail.com> wrote:

...

Dear Sheri,

I think the basic documentation "ChucK_manual.pdf" that one gets when you download chuck is actually rather good, for me, the clarity of that manual is what actually got me hooked many years ago.

My 2 cents regarding the future of ChucK: I still run it every day. For playing around with experimental DSP that includes compositional ideas, I think it is still really cool (I've tried Faust, but find it a bit to focused on DSP). I also know ChucK was used at Sonology institute in The Hague for teaching (some of the) DSP classes.

I have to say that I am running into its limitations (especially that code can get very verbose, because of its similarity to Java). I noticed some of my live-coded programs got unreadable/uneditable because of it. I especially miss functional programming syntax, which is why I now use a translation script written in Python: https://github.com/casperschipper/cisp, which takes a scheme like syntax and translates it into chuck. Since the syntax of that is very different from chuck, I could imagine it someday 'compiles' to another (more efficient) language, but for now, ChucK is ok.

Regarding performance, I sometimes schedule supercollider events through OSC with chuck, this gives me the nice strong-timing syntax of chuck and the efficiency of supercollider server, but I guess for beginners this is a bit messy construction.

Best, Casper

On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 10:42 AM, Sheri W-J mailto:Sheri@wells-jensen.net> wrote:

Hello, Folks, Can someone tell me where to find the YouAreReasonablySmartButHavingTroubleGettingStarted documentation? I'm having trouble getting past the initial steps: I've done some Perl programming but I could use maybe ... I guess if I knew exactly what I needed, then I wouldn't need it! Is the book I see advertised on the Check homepage my answer? If it is, is that book available electronically anywhere? I'm blind, so purchasing a hard copy would mean running it through OCR which would introduce pesky errors. Thanks for any tips. Best, Sheri

On Jan 14, 2018, at 1:12 PM, Stuart Roland mailto:stuartroland@gmail.com> wrote:

...

I can't speak to the future of ChucK itself, but recently I have been giving a lot of thought to MY future with Chuck. First off, I love ChucK and all the cool stuff it let's me create. I find it much more intuitive than any other audio programming language/environment I have used and I can usually create something along the lines of what I set out to create with it. My problem with it is that I really want to be able to create stand alone apps and plugins with it, which I have not found any way of doing. I would like for my software to be usable by the average musician, not just by programmer-musicians who can read ChucK code (though we are a cool bunch). I know ChucK Racks were just released (for Macs,which I don't use) but as I understand, this just let's you run ChucK scripts as a plugin, and does not provide a way to wrap up the code in any UI to distribute to musicians who are used to sliders, knobs, presets etc.

So I guess I have a few questions for everyone/anyone here: is there a way to use ChucK in a mobile or desktop app? Is there a way to connect ChucK to a GUI that is simple enough that non-programmers could use it? If not, is there another language / libraries for another language like python, for example, that has some of the great, intuitive design as ChucK? Is ChucK more of an educational tool at this point and less of a tool for developers?

Thanks for taking the time to read. Happy audio/music making!

Stuart

On Jan 14, 2018 11:00 AM, mailto:chuck-users-request@lists.cs.princeton.edu> wrote:

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: static strings and the future (JP Yepez)

---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: JP Yepez mailto:jpyepezimc@gmail.com> To: ChucK Users Mailing List mailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu> Cc: Bcc: Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2018 15:53:30 +1300 Subject: Re: [chuck-users] static strings and the future Hello all,

I can't say much about the development part itself, but in my experience I've noticed that ChucK is still being used widely at an academic level. I understand it's being used in a few universities that include creative technology programs and computer orchestra courses in their curriculums, including CalArts, Stanford, and VUW (New Zealand). Like Mario mentioned, it is a core part of a few Kadenze courses; I've been involved as a producer/teaching assistant in a couple of them and it seems like it's a popular language among students who are just learning how to code, and musicians who would like to develop more advanced projects. Also, ChucK Racks popped up a couple of months ago, which was pretty exciting. So yeah, I think there's quite a bit going on, but it certainly would be nice to have a more active community (I'm hoping to contribute, and hopefully I'll get to it before too long).

About the *static strings* issue, I think they're kind of in a shady spot. Like Gonzalo mentioned, you can't have static non-primitives in your code, but there is a workaround to this by declaring objects as a reference and then initializing them outside of the class. However, if you try to do this with strings, it will tell you that they're a primitive type and it throws an error. The best hack I've found for this is through arrays (even if the size of the array is 1 in many cases). Here's an example:

publicclassContainer{

staticstringstaticString[];

publicstaticvoidinit(){

newstring[1]@=>staticString;

"Hello World"@=>staticString[0];

}

publicstaticvoidprint(){

<<>>;

}

}

Container.init();

Container.print();

You don't really need an init() function, and you can initialize the array on the actual script, but I usually end up with much larger classes, which is why I like to keep things clean. Hope this helps!

Best,

JP

*JP Yepez* New Media Artist - Musician - Researcher Website:http://www.jpyepez.com/ Email: jpyepezimc@gmail.com mailto:jpyepezimc@gmail.com -------------------------------------------------------- https://www.instagram.com/jpyepez/https://twitter.com/jpyepezmusichttps://www.linkedin.com/in/jp-yepez-063928123/

On Sun, Jan 14, 2018 at 12:19 AM, mario buoninfante mailto:mario.buoninfante@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi,

I'd like to ask the same question about the development status.

the only thing I can say is that also if the development seems to be a bit stuck, on the other side I noticed that they're pushing on the educational side (see Kadenze courses), and if you look at the github repository, there's been some update in the last 2 years.

but as you guys said, it's important to know what's the plan ;)

it's a couple of years I'm really diving into ChucK and I strongly believe that is a good programming language which opens up a lot of possibilities that other languages don't.

but at the same time I feel like it's been a bit abandoned (maybe that's a huge word, let's say put aside ;) ) and of course using a "tool"  which has an "uncertain future" it's not the best thing.

I wish I was able to offer my contribution to the development, but unfortunately I'm not really into C/C++, I'm more a "scripting language guy" :)

btw, it would be nice to hear what developers and/or other users have to say about it.

cheers,

Mario

On 12/01/18 22:14, Gonzalo wrote:

Yes, I'm wondering the same thing. There's a Facebook group (https://www.facebook.com/groups/1593843507578422/ https://www.facebook.com/groups/1593843507578422/) but it doesn't look super active either.

As far as static strings: I'm pretty sure you just can't have static non-primitives. What are you trying to achieve?

Cheers, Gonzalo

On 13.01.18 00:20, Atte wrote:

Hi

I've been away for a long time and surprised that activity seems to have slowed down a lot, both on the development of new releases chuck and the life of this list. Am I looking at the wrong places? What's the status of chuck development now and in the future?

I really like chuck (mostly the timing and sporking including Machine.add()), should I look other places for a language that will privide a more secure future? I'm on linux and looked at Csound, Super Collider and PD, each has it's challenges in how I work (realtime generative and algorithmic MIDI), python seems to have realtime problems (garbage collection at random points). Any idea what former chuck users have switched to now?

Back to chuck! A problem that I never been able to solve, static strings:

public class A {      "b" @=> static string B;

     public static void C(){     <<<B>>>;      } }

That throws an error, how would I go about what I'm trying to do?

Cheers

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-- Casper Schipper casper.schipper@gmail.com mailto:casper.schipper@gmail.com +31 6 52 322 590 _______________________________________________ chuck-users mailing list chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu mailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu https://lists.cs.princeton.edu/mailman/listinfo/chuck-users

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Great stuff! Am using a mac myself though no braille display even though i can read it i just have the built in voice over ________________________________ From: chuck-users-bounces@lists.cs.princeton.edu on behalf of Sheri W-J Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 10:55:47 AM To: rich Cc: ChucK Users Mailing List Subject: Re: [chuck-users] [chuck-users new user: silly questions Thanks, Everyone for the tips: Rich, yes, I use a screen reader with a braille display on my Mac. I've opened Miniaudicle and poked at the menus some, but I am still dithering between opening the Mac terminal and doing things from the command line vs. using the Miniaudicle. It's always this first getting started bit that throws me: it took me a week to get Perl installed on my mac, but once it was there and I knew where things were, learning the language went pretty fast. What I do with Perl is write my code using a text editor, save the text file with the right extension and then open the Mac's terminal window and either use the command line to call the program or (because most of what I code is little practice CGI'S for my students) upload them to my server and use the Perl compiler there. I hope that makes sense. Is that analogous to what you do? ... And I think what you said means that having installed miniaudicle, I should also now have a chuck directory somewhere that I can get to via the terminal window on my Mac? Is that right? Thanks, Sheri On Jan 16, 2018, at 12:22 PM, rich mailto:rjc@mit.edu> wrote: Hi Sheri. On windows, chuck gets installed into "c:\Program Files (x86)\ChucK". On linux, I do not know where to find it, but most likely /user/bin or /usr/local/bin, but not being much of a linux user, really not sure. I noticed in your previous message you said you were visually impaired. Are you using a screen reader? If so, Mini Audicle may not be accessible; it is not on windows at all. If your using magnification, you've probably got a good chance of making use of it. I also happen to be blind and use a screen reader on windows. I've done chuck hacking with just the command line and a text editor; it works pretty well. However, if you want to pass parameters to your program you need to do everything either on the command line, or hard code parameters into your source. For experimentation it's fine, but for something which needs to be used by others, it may become quite hard to manage as things get complicated. The mini audical apparently allows you to create UI widgets that can send parameters to a running chuck program, which means you can vary things on the fly, which you cannot do just running from the command line. All that said, it's a great language and you can learn a lot about signal processing playing with chuck. Complements to the chuck team for their continuous work on the language over the years. It's probably the most accessible audio processing language out there, mostly because it is just the language; it does not require a complex GUI environment in which to run. Hope this is helpful. -- Rich On 1/15/2018 2:39 PM, Sheri W-J wrote: I promise to have real thinking questions later but for now: The program I installed (which seemed like my only choice) was miniaudicle. The online documentation is prompting me to run chuck from the command line... I know about the terminal and I run perl from the command line so that would be OK ... except these two things do not match up, and I see nothing actually called chuck on my hard drive. What did I miss? Thanks so much, Sheri On Jan 15, 2018, at 6:47 AM, Casper Schipper mailto:casper.schipper@gmail.com> wrote: Dear Sheri, I think the basic documentation "ChucK_manual.pdf" that one gets when you download chuck is actually rather good, for me, the clarity of that manual is what actually got me hooked many years ago. My 2 cents regarding the future of ChucK: I still run it every day. For playing around with experimental DSP that includes compositional ideas, I think it is still really cool (I've tried Faust, but find it a bit to focused on DSP). I also know ChucK was used at Sonology institute in The Hague for teaching (some of the) DSP classes. I have to say that I am running into its limitations (especially that code can get very verbose, because of its similarity to Java). I noticed some of my live-coded programs got unreadable/uneditable because of it. I especially miss functional programming syntax, which is why I now use a translation script written in Python: https://github.com/casperschipper/cisp, which takes a scheme like syntax and translates it into chuck. Since the syntax of that is very different from chuck, I could imagine it someday 'compiles' to another (more efficient) language, but for now, ChucK is ok. Regarding performance, I sometimes schedule supercollider events through OSC with chuck, this gives me the nice strong-timing syntax of chuck and the efficiency of supercollider server, but I guess for beginners this is a bit messy construction. Best, Casper On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 10:42 AM, Sheri W-J mailto:Sheri@wells-jensen.net> wrote: Hello, Folks, Can someone tell me where to find the YouAreReasonablySmartButHavingTroubleGettingStarted documentation? I'm having trouble getting past the initial steps: I've done some Perl programming but I could use maybe ... I guess if I knew exactly what I needed, then I wouldn't need it! Is the book I see advertised on the Check homepage my answer? If it is, is that book available electronically anywhere? I'm blind, so purchasing a hard copy would mean running it through OCR which would introduce pesky errors. Thanks for any tips. Best, Sheri On Jan 14, 2018, at 1:12 PM, Stuart Roland mailto:stuartroland@gmail.com> wrote: I can't speak to the future of ChucK itself, but recently I have been giving a lot of thought to MY future with Chuck. First off, I love ChucK and all the cool stuff it let's me create. I find it much more intuitive than any other audio programming language/environment I have used and I can usually create something along the lines of what I set out to create with it. My problem with it is that I really want to be able to create stand alone apps and plugins with it, which I have not found any way of doing. I would like for my software to be usable by the average musician, not just by programmer-musicians who can read ChucK code (though we are a cool bunch). I know ChucK Racks were just released (for Macs,which I don't use) but as I understand, this just let's you run ChucK scripts as a plugin, and does not provide a way to wrap up the code in any UI to distribute to musicians who are used to sliders, knobs, presets etc. So I guess I have a few questions for everyone/anyone here: is there a way to use ChucK in a mobile or desktop app? Is there a way to connect ChucK to a GUI that is simple enough that non-programmers could use it? If not, is there another language / libraries for another language like python, for example, that has some of the great, intuitive design as ChucK? Is ChucK more of an educational tool at this point and less of a tool for developers? Thanks for taking the time to read. Happy audio/music making! Stuart On Jan 14, 2018 11:00 AM, mailto:chuck-users-request@lists.cs.princeton.edu> wrote: Send chuck-users mailing list submissions to chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edumailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://lists.cs.princeton.edu/mailman/listinfo/chuck-users or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to chuck-users-request@lists.cs.princeton.edumailto:chuck-users-request@lists.cs.princeton.edu You can reach the person managing the list at chuck-users-owner@lists.cs.princeton.edumailto:chuck-users-owner@lists.cs.princeton.edu When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of chuck-users digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: static strings and the future (JP Yepez) ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: JP Yepez mailto:jpyepezimc@gmail.com> To: ChucK Users Mailing List mailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu> Cc: Bcc: Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2018 15:53:30 +1300 Subject: Re: [chuck-users] static strings and the future Hello all, I can't say much about the development part itself, but in my experience I've noticed that ChucK is still being used widely at an academic level. I understand it's being used in a few universities that include creative technology programs and computer orchestra courses in their curriculums, including CalArts, Stanford, and VUW (New Zealand). Like Mario mentioned, it is a core part of a few Kadenze courses; I've been involved as a producer/teaching assistant in a couple of them and it seems like it's a popular language among students who are just learning how to code, and musicians who would like to develop more advanced projects. Also, ChucK Racks popped up a couple of months ago, which was pretty exciting. So yeah, I think there's quite a bit going on, but it certainly would be nice to have a more active community (I'm hoping to contribute, and hopefully I'll get to it before too long). About the static strings issue, I think they're kind of in a shady spot. Like Gonzalo mentioned, you can't have static non-primitives in your code, but there is a workaround to this by declaring objects as a reference and then initializing them outside of the class. However, if you try to do this with strings, it will tell you that they're a primitive type and it throws an error. The best hack I've found for this is through arrays (even if the size of the array is 1 in many cases). Here's an example: public class Container { static string staticString[]; public static void init() { new string[1] @=> staticString; "Hello World" @=> staticString[0]; } public static void print(){ <<< staticString[0] >>>; } } Container.init(); Container.print(); You don't really need an init() function, and you can initialize the array on the actual script, but I usually end up with much larger classes, which is why I like to keep things clean. Hope this helps! Best, JP JP Yepez New Media Artist - Musician - Researcher Website: http://www.jpyepez.com/ Email: jpyepezimc@gmail.commailto:jpyepezimc@gmail.com -------------------------------------------------------- [https://images2.imgbox.com/62/2e/OWpabMBi_o.png]https://www.instagram.com/jpyepez/ [https://images2.imgbox.com/65/2a/b3Gn8mIm_o.png] https://twitter.com/jpyepezmusic [https://images2.imgbox.com/21/22/7IKM1kB9_o.png] https://www.linkedin.com/in/jp-yepez-063928123/ On Sun, Jan 14, 2018 at 12:19 AM, mario buoninfante mailto:mario.buoninfante@gmail.com> wrote: Hi, I'd like to ask the same question about the development status. the only thing I can say is that also if the development seems to be a bit stuck, on the other side I noticed that they're pushing on the educational side (see Kadenze courses), and if you look at the github repository, there's been some update in the last 2 years. but as you guys said, it's important to know what's the plan ;) it's a couple of years I'm really diving into ChucK and I strongly believe that is a good programming language which opens up a lot of possibilities that other languages don't. but at the same time I feel like it's been a bit abandoned (maybe that's a huge word, let's say put aside ;) ) and of course using a "tool" which has an "uncertain future" it's not the best thing. I wish I was able to offer my contribution to the development, but unfortunately I'm not really into C/C++, I'm more a "scripting language guy" :) btw, it would be nice to hear what developers and/or other users have to say about it. cheers, Mario On 12/01/18 22:14, Gonzalo wrote: Yes, I'm wondering the same thing. There's a Facebook group (https://www.facebook.com/groups/1593843507578422/) but it doesn't look super active either. As far as static strings: I'm pretty sure you just can't have static non-primitives. What are you trying to achieve? Cheers, Gonzalo On 13.01.18 00:20, Atte wrote: Hi I've been away for a long time and surprised that activity seems to have slowed down a lot, both on the development of new releases chuck and the life of this list. Am I looking at the wrong places? What's the status of chuck development now and in the future? I really like chuck (mostly the timing and sporking including Machine.add()), should I look other places for a language that will privide a more secure future? I'm on linux and looked at Csound, Super Collider and PD, each has it's challenges in how I work (realtime generative and algorithmic MIDI), python seems to have realtime problems (garbage collection at random points). Any idea what former chuck users have switched to now? Back to chuck! A problem that I never been able to solve, static strings: public class A { "b" @=> static string B; public static void C(){ <<<B>>>; } } That throws an error, how would I go about what I'm trying to do? Cheers _______________________________________________ chuck-users mailing list chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edumailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu https://lists.cs.princeton.edu/mailman/listinfo/chuck-users _______________________________________________ chuck-users mailing list chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edumailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu https://lists.cs.princeton.edu/mailman/listinfo/chuck-users _______________________________________________ chuck-users mailing list chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edumailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu https://lists.cs.princeton.edu/mailman/listinfo/chuck-users _______________________________________________ chuck-users mailing list chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edumailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu https://lists.cs.princeton.edu/mailman/listinfo/chuck-users -- Casper Schipper casper.schipper@gmail.commailto:casper.schipper@gmail.com +31 6 52 322 590 _______________________________________________ chuck-users mailing list chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edumailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu https://lists.cs.princeton.edu/mailman/listinfo/chuck-users _______________________________________________ chuck-users mailing list chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edumailto:chuck-users@lists.cs.princeton.edu https://lists.cs.princeton.edu/mailman/listinfo/chuck-users